Početna » Martin Owens » Resursi » PasteBin » IRC Meeting for Hackfest 2014-09-15
  1. johan_e, ping as requested
  2. johan_e
  3. johan_e 03:04:06 PM
  4. pong
  5. bryce
  6. bryce 03:04:21 PM
  7. karenesq, welcome to the inkscape channel!
  8. karenesq
  9. karenesq 03:04:34 PM
  10. thanks! happy to be here to chat
  11. bryce
  12. bryce 03:05:16 PM
  13. karenesq, I know we want to discuss the hackfest and associated fundraising, but I don't have an agenda beyond that. I'm trusting you have some specifics you'd like to discuss?
  14. karenesq
  15. karenesq 03:05:42 PM
  16. bryce, I figured we'd want to go through the points that Bradley set out in his email
  17. but the one point I wanted to raise first was about the new FSA with conservancy? 03:05:56 PM
  18. I think that's kind of languished a few times... 03:06:03 PM
  19. Mc-
  20. Mc- 03:07:16 PM
  21. ("FSA" ?)
  22. karenesq
  23. karenesq 03:07:31 PM
  24. sorry Mc- fiscal sponsorship agreement
  25. all of conservancy's member projects were asked to sign an updated FSA 03:07:47 PM
  26. I don't think it was too controversial but I think it hasn't gotten the attention to get it done 03:08:09 PM
  27. bryce may have more information 03:08:14 PM
  28. Tavmjong
  29. Tavmjong 03:09:01 PM
  30. What are the changes we want? I can think of two...
  31. 1. 10% to SFC 03:09:07 PM
  32. 2. Handling inactive board members. 03:09:26 PM
  33. karenesq
  34. karenesq 03:09:27 PM
  35. I think the only potentially controversial part about that is that Conservancy would get 10% of revenues, but while it sounds like a lot it doesn't actually keep us afloat to give us the ability to support the member projects
  36. doctormon
  37. doctormon 03:09:30 PM
  38. Tav: 10% from what?
  39. ScislaC
  40. ScislaC 03:09:47 PM
  41. what we take in
  42. Tavmjong
  43. Tavmjong 03:09:54 PM
  44. From contributions. We agreed to this already in principle.
  45. karenesq
  46. karenesq 03:10:02 PM
  47. we do a ton of general fundraising to support our staff so that we can have a lawyer on staff, etc
  48. Mc-
  49. Mc- 03:10:33 PM
  50. [ "The FIXME-SIGNATORIES agree to donate ten percent (10%) of the Project’s gross revenue (including, but not necessarily limited to, all income and donations) to Conservancy for its general operations. " if what i found by googling is the right document ]
  51. doctormon
  52. doctormon 03:10:42 PM
  53. karenesq: The big problem with 10%, is that it's 10% on top of the fundraising platform like kickstarter or patreon etc. It'd be really good if the conservency was a fundraising platform itself.
  54. karenesq
  55. karenesq 03:11:17 PM
  56. I'd love for that to be the case doctormon and we definitely would be happy for someone to volunteer to implement that for us!
  57. doctormon anyway I didn't mean to derail the discussion by mentioning this, I thought it was already agreed upon, I just wanted to get the housekeeping out of the way 03:11:50 PM
  58. doctormon
  59. doctormon 03:12:53 PM
  60. karenesq: If you're being paid money, volunteering the tools too is a bit cheeky. Payment should be in exchange for services and with regards to fund raising at least, the conservancy isn't offering many services. We have to outsource those.
  61. karenesq: OK, sorry thought it was on the agenda, ignore me! 03:13:05 PM
  62. karenesq
  63. karenesq 03:13:35 PM
  64. doctormon, well, the amount of money we take in from our projects in total barely supports the bookkeeping :)
  65. ScislaC
  66. ScislaC 03:13:37 PM
  67. it's just something we need to keep in mind when setting a goal for something like a kickstarter
  68. doctormon
  69. doctormon 03:14:10 PM
  70. I'll table my response karenesq, what's next on the agenda?
  71. tedg has joined the room 03:14:28 PM
  72. Tavmjong
  73. Tavmjong 03:14:41 PM
  74. We'll have three board members at GSoC. That might be a good time to finish of the FSA.
  75. ... that GSoC Mentors meeting... 03:14:52 PM
  76. johan_e
  77. johan_e 03:14:59 PM
  78. what is a common percentage for funding platforms? So, as ScislaC mentions, we know by how much to multiply the budget. And then we can see if that is a reachable goal.
  79. karenesq
  80. karenesq 03:15:05 PM
  81. ok cool Tavmjong. I'll be there for part of that, and Bradley will be there too
  82. ok, so I think there were two main things to discuss - fundraising and goals to accomplish to be fundraised for 03:16:35 PM
  83. Tavmjong
  84. Tavmjong 03:16:51 PM
  85. Does someone have a link to Bradley's email? Or could they forward it to me?
  86. johan_e
  87. johan_e 03:17:19 PM
  88. karenesq: can we discuss them in opposite order?
  89. (so goals first) 03:17:27 PM
  90. karenesq
  91. karenesq 03:17:31 PM
  92. Tavmjong: we can just got through the points here, so we're all on the same page
  93. yeah johan_e, I was going to suggest that actually 03:17:39 PM
  94. bryce
  95. bryce 03:18:55 PM
  96. so, for the hackfest, the goals we discussed was to have a ~3 day event scheduled to lead or follow the Libre Graphics Meeting in April
  97. location is not set in stone, but LGM is in Toronto iirc, and we were thinking Boston, so doctormon could help with legwork to do arrangements 03:19:35 PM
  98. karenesq, where are you located? 03:19:43 PM
  99. karenesq
  100. karenesq 03:19:54 PM
  101. bryce: I'm in Brooklyn, NY
  102. bryce
  103. bryce 03:20:16 PM
  104. ok, thought you might be east coast :-)
  105. karenesq
  106. karenesq 03:20:18 PM
  107. :)
  108. I always help set up the GNOME Boston Summit 03:20:43 PM
  109. there are a lot of universities that are potential hosts 03:21:09 PM
  110. doctormon
  111. doctormon 03:21:18 PM
  112. Indeed there are.
  113. karenesq
  114. karenesq 03:21:19 PM
  115. and I bet the FSF people would help if we asked
  116. Annabel has joined the room 03:21:32 PM
  117. Annabel has disconnected (Changing host) 03:21:32 PM
  118. Annabel has joined the room 03:21:32 PM
  119. bryce
  120. bryce 03:21:38 PM
  121. so, for the event itself we'll be setting some development objectives, but we haven't pinpointed those. We're thinking stuff which is easily parallelizable, so we might have someone give a tutorial or orientation talk, and then people can hack on the refactoring.
  122. johan_e
  123. johan_e 03:21:59 PM
  124. we've made a wiki page to collect our planning for the hackfest: http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/Hackfest2015
  125. Annabel has disconnected (Client Quit) 03:22:02 PM
  126. bryce
  127. bryce 03:22:14 PM
  128. karenesq, Ted suggested MIT. We've done an Inkscape event at MIT there once before, so we may have some contacts.
  129. karenesq
  130. karenesq 03:22:16 PM
  131. for GNOME we always get Walter Bender (of Sugar Labs, another conservancy project) to reserve the rooms at MIT
  132. bryce
  133. bryce 03:22:19 PM
  134. thanks johan_e
  135. karenesq
  136. karenesq 03:23:00 PM
  137. sounds really good
  138. *goes to check out the link* 03:23:05 PM
  139. johan_e
  140. johan_e 03:23:20 PM
  141. I have never attended a hackfest. I also imagine they vary wildly, but still, perhaps someone could help me with 'scale'. how large are these things, what kind of people attend?
  142. bryce
  143. bryce 03:23:34 PM
  144. in terms of budget items, I expect we'll need money for refreshments (catered lunches??)
  145. johan_e - jon_y - 03:23:56 PM
  146. bryce
  147. bryce 03:24:14 PM
  148. if the venue doesn't include a projector set up, we may have costs associated with that
  149. karenesq
  150. karenesq 03:24:48 PM
  151. it really depends on the event johan_e, but you'd probably want to turn the participants section into a sign up of interest (with yes or maybe) and then start to get an idea
  152. bryce
  153. bryce 03:24:53 PM
  154. most of the budget will be for travel, accommodation (and food?) reimbursement for attendees
  155. tedg
  156. tedg 03:25:02 PM
  157. johan_e, Typically 5-10, contributors of all types, but usually people with a "job to do" not just passers-by.
  158. doctormon
  159. doctormon 03:25:14 PM
  160. johan_e: The LibreOffice hackfest was about 12 people, the Gnome hackfest is lots more. I've attended them at MIT, Harvard, FSF, Akami and the mono office.
  161. Tavmjong
  162. Tavmjong 03:25:28 PM
  163. How expensive is Boston (having just been to London, ouch!)?
  164. bryce
  165. bryce 03:25:31 PM
  166. yeah I'd say 8 people would be minimum
  167. karenesq
  168. karenesq 03:25:43 PM
  169. he GNOME boston summit is usually like 30-50 people
  170. doctormon
  171. doctormon 03:25:55 PM
  172. Tavmjong: They guy that stays in my spare room gets free breakfasts ;-)
  173. johan_e
  174. johan_e 03:25:58 PM
  175. because it's our first time, I guess we expect a small number then
  176. karenesq
  177. karenesq 03:26:09 PM
  178. Boston is pretty pricey but more reasonable than NY or SF
  179. johan_e: how many is the core team that you know will go? 03:26:26 PM
  180. tedg
  181. tedg 03:26:40 PM
  182. I think that could be the argument for Toronto, I think Toronto is generally cheaper. But not having "boots on the ground" is a big downside.
  183. karenesq
  184. karenesq 03:26:49 PM
  185. inkscape is pretty popular though so it might be a good time to do outreach
  186. bryce
  187. bryce 03:27:06 PM
  188. we've not done a head count, but total number of active developers is less than 50, maybe less than 30
  189. karenesq
  190. karenesq 03:27:23 PM
  191. tedg, that's a good idea, you can always try to coordinate with the LGM organizers and see if they can just fold you into their organizing
  192. bryce
  193. bryce 03:27:45 PM
  194. I'm guessing we'd be lucky to get 50% of active devs to attend, so figure a maximum of 15-20
  195. karenesq
  196. karenesq 03:27:52 PM
  197. sometimes it's easy for them to just arrange for another room then
  198. ScislaC
  199. ScislaC 03:28:14 PM
  200. how many Inkscape developers attended LGM this year?
  201. Tavmjong
  202. Tavmjong 03:28:21 PM
  203. I would think that we should aim for 10 developers for our first effort.
  204. We had about eight at LGM... but that includes a couple translators. 03:28:46 PM
  205. karenesq
  206. karenesq 03:29:39 PM
  207. is there complete overlap in the people going to LGM and those going to the hackfest?
  208. bryce
  209. bryce 03:29:52 PM
  210. hmm, we could probably draw in more people if we emphasize doing work on the documentation side of the project; certainly we need it, and f2f can hugely benefit documenters
  211. karenesq
  212. karenesq 03:30:30 PM
  213. yeah definitely bryce
  214. tedg
  215. tedg 03:30:40 PM
  216. karenesq, I think everyone going to the hackfest would be interested in going to LGM.
  217. johan_e
  218. johan_e 03:30:41 PM
  219. karenesq: i think we should aim for complete overlap.
  220. karenesq
  221. karenesq 03:30:54 PM
  222. one thing that has worked for other projects I've helped in the past is to have a training session in the morning of the first day for newcomers
  223. and advertise it heavily at the universities 03:31:01 PM
  224. and have folks ready to do some hands on outreach 03:31:26 PM
  225. then you can fold the productive people into the hackfest 03:31:36 PM
  226. bryce
  227. bryce 03:31:52 PM
  228. 'outreach' here meaning recruiting developers from userbase?
  229. karenesq
  230. karenesq 03:32:29 PM
  231. either that bryce or outreach for documentation people
  232. for documentation this works particularly well 03:32:48 PM
  233. doctormon
  234. doctormon 03:33:09 PM
  235. If we do a torronto hackfest, then it'd be good to have it slightly outside of LGM time too.
  236. Maybe at the weekend 03:33:14 PM
  237. karenesq
  238. karenesq 03:33:27 PM
  239. if you want complete overlap it really might make sense to have it in Toronto either before or after
  240. it will save some money on having to travel twice 03:33:38 PM
  241. and also there may be fewer visa issues if you avoid the US 03:33:48 PM
  242. is there a way you can call for help from people based in Toronto? Is there a user group that might have some people who want to help? 03:34:35 PM
  243. Tavmjong
  244. Tavmjong 03:34:56 PM
  245. From Europe the difference in airfare is minimal but it might be more convenient to co-locate.
  246. johan_e
  247. johan_e 03:35:17 PM
  248. as you mentioned, we could ask the LGM people for help about organization
  249. bryce
  250. bryce 03:35:46 PM
  251. sounds like an action item to investigate that
  252. who'd like to own it? :-) 03:35:55 PM
  253. Mc-
  254. Mc- 03:36:44 PM
  255. From Europe, not sure it's easy to pass the Canada-US border
  256. US visas can be a pain at times 03:36:59 PM
  257. doctormon
  258. doctormon 03:37:11 PM
  259. LGM is in April 2015. So we're talking about a longer delay than anticipated until the event too.
  260. karenesq
  261. karenesq 03:37:40 PM
  262. oh I see doctormon! Is there another event many of you are likely to be at before then? Like FOSDEM maybe?
  263. bryce
  264. bryce 03:38:12 PM
  265. doctormon, right. But given how slow our project typically moves on things, I don't think its an inappropriately large amount of time
  266. ScislaC
  267. ScislaC 03:38:25 PM
  268. agreed bryce
  269. karenesq
  270. karenesq 03:38:33 PM
  271. I'm coming in without too much background so you have to fill me in
  272. tedg
  273. tedg 03:38:34 PM
  274. Yeah, I'd agree, especially first time. We might become a well oiled machine at some point, but we're not today.
  275. johan_e
  276. johan_e 03:38:53 PM
  277. for me personally, april would be fine. earlier has high chance of conflict with other things
  278. doctormon
  279. doctormon 03:39:27 PM
  280. bryce: I can see the hope of future speed in your ascii art ;-)
  281. johan_e
  282. johan_e 03:39:29 PM
  283. 7 months out seems OK yeah
  284. bryce
  285. bryce 03:39:30 PM
  286. I think having it associated with LGM will likely result in better attendance and better results from *both* events
  287. johan_e
  288. johan_e 03:39:45 PM
  289. bryce, indeed
  290. bryce
  291. bryce 03:39:51 PM
  292. doctormon, heh, which art is that?
  293. karenesq
  294. karenesq 03:39:55 PM
  295. heh well it's good to have a long lead time
  296. it's surprising how much it helps, actually 03:40:10 PM
  297. bryce
  298. bryce 03:41:18 PM
  299. ok, I guess we'll need to leave location up in the air for the time being.
  300. tedg
  301. tedg 03:41:19 PM
  302. I do think someone needs to be the "chairperson" for the event.
  303. karenesq
  304. karenesq 03:41:27 PM
  305. so I could help get in touch with the LGM organizers, but it probably is better for someone in the core team to do it
  306. you're much more likely to bond and find ways to help both events :) 03:41:40 PM
  307. Tavmjong
  308. Tavmjong 03:41:40 PM
  309. Has anybody attended FOSDEM? Would it be interesting for us?
  310. bryce
  311. bryce 03:42:31 PM
  312. Tavmjong, I've not attended but it does sound interesting.
  313. doctormon
  314. doctormon 03:43:03 PM
  315. OK I've emailed Ginger Coons about hooking up LGM 2015 to this hackfest.
  316. karenesq
  317. karenesq 03:43:17 PM
  318. awesome doctormon
  319. Tavmjong
  320. Tavmjong 03:43:22 PM
  321. It might be a place to have a mini-hackfest as a warm-up excercise.
  322. ScislaC
  323. ScislaC 03:43:24 PM
  324. thanks doctormon
  325. karenesq
  326. karenesq 03:43:46 PM
  327. so I guess we wait and see on that
  328. but you should try to line up sponsors now 03:43:54 PM
  329. a lot of companies do their budgeting in November 03:44:03 PM
  330. doctormon
  331. doctormon 03:44:07 PM
  332. Where is FOSDEM this year? (Software Freedom Day is this Saturday, Boston event happening)
  333. karenesq
  334. karenesq 03:44:19 PM
  335. FOSDEM is always in Brussels doctormon
  336. Tavmjong
  337. Tavmjong 03:44:19 PM
  338. https://fosdem.org/2015/schedule/
  339. johan_e
  340. johan_e 03:45:33 PM
  341. (how come these things are always in the middle of the week? no-one works here?! :( ;))
  342. karenesq
  343. karenesq 03:45:42 PM
  344. which companies might likely sponsor?
  345. johan_e: FOSDEM is always Saturday and Sunday :) 03:45:55 PM
  346. bryce
  347. bryce 03:46:10 PM
  348. karenesq, depending on how it's defined and marketed I might get my employer to contribute some
  349. johan_e
  350. johan_e 03:46:11 PM
  351. argh sorry, one month off
  352. thanks :) 03:46:16 PM
  353. ScislaC
  354. ScislaC 03:46:20 PM
  355. karenesq: is this the type of thing projects would typically seek out sponsorship for from companies? (Being a chair with SCaLE, I get doing it as conference organizers)
  356. karenesq
  357. karenesq 03:46:21 PM
  358. you know, you can sometimes tell how commuinity based a conference is by when it is scheduled
  359. corporate-y ones are always midweek 03:46:27 PM
  360. doctormon
  361. doctormon 03:46:45 PM
  362. I've emailed mo from RedHat about sponsorship from them.
  363. karenesq
  364. karenesq 03:46:49 PM
  365. yes ScislaC, and it's something we can help with
  366. doctormon: with Ruth? 03:47:01 PM
  367. we should coordinate this - where you guys have good contacts you should ask 03:47:25 PM
  368. and I can ask where I have good contacts 03:47:38 PM
  369. doctormon
  370. doctormon 03:48:06 PM
  371. karenesq: I've enquired via Marian Duffy. She's always ready to help promote inkscape. But anyone else at RH would be helpful too.
  372. karenesq
  373. karenesq 03:48:10 PM
  374. we probably should put together a collaborative document where we can post ideas for companies to hit up
  375. and who will do it 03:48:12 PM
  376. Mc-
  377. Mc- 03:48:30 PM
  378. is ti possible to have public sponsorship from the venue ? (city, mit, etc)
  379. karenesq
  380. karenesq 03:48:31 PM
  381. cool doctormon, as I undertand it Ruth has the event sponsorship budget
  382. Tavmjong
  383. Tavmjong 03:48:36 PM
  384. Do we have any good contacts? I think people assume that Inkscape is a much larger, better funded, etc. project that it really is.
  385. doctormon
  386. doctormon 03:48:37 PM
  387. bryce: Want to ask Canonical? I know you're not there any more, but maybe a quick email to the right boss?
  388. bryce
  389. bryce 03:48:41 PM
  390. Intel is another option, particularly if we include Cairo as part of it
  391. karenesq
  392. karenesq 03:48:42 PM
  393. mo is so awesome :)
  394. johan_e
  395. johan_e 03:48:51 PM
  396. why would a company sponsor us? (honest question. if we know a bit better, we can accomodate their wishes)
  397. Mc-
  398. Mc- 03:49:15 PM
  399. johan_e: good publicity, tax advantages
  400. karenesq
  401. karenesq 03:49:21 PM
  402. johan_e, you have to think about who uses inkscape and wants it to be better
  403. sometimes it's also good PR 03:49:29 PM
  404. ScislaC
  405. ScislaC 03:49:31 PM
  406. maybe tedg could ask Canonical?
  407. tedg
  408. tedg 03:49:32 PM
  409. doctormon, I can ask around, not sure who to ask today, but I can try to figure that out.
  410. I think that PR is probably the primary benefit. 03:49:50 PM
  411. doctormon
  412. doctormon 03:49:53 PM
  413. johan_e: A company may wish to be seen in good standing, especially if it gets bug fixes etc.
  414. bryce
  415. bryce 03:49:55 PM
  416. doctormon, yeah I could ask Rick when we have things a bit more nailed down. Canonical has typically been pretty miserly but can't hurt to ask. At the least we can invite them to send a dev or two.
  417. doctormon
  418. doctormon 03:50:11 PM
  419. bryce: lol
  420. karenesq
  421. karenesq 03:50:12 PM
  422. cool doctormon, tedg, I can also ask Rick
  423. heh 03:50:16 PM
  424. johan_e
  425. johan_e 03:50:24 PM
  426. OK, so I get: PR among coders? (or PR among users?)
  427. doctormon
  428. doctormon 03:50:52 PM
  429. johan_e: Yes, both.
  430. karenesq
  431. karenesq 03:51:12 PM
  432. johan_e, users because users are often customers, and coders if they're trying to recruit
  433. johan_e
  434. johan_e 03:51:46 PM
  435. OK, so can we offer them a logo on our website in a newsitem for a couple of weeks?
  436. Inkscape hackfest sponsored by... 03:51:59 PM
  437. bryce
  438. bryce 03:52:02 PM
  439. my current employer (Samsung) actually has budgeted for sponsoring hackfests specifically
  440. karenesq
  441. karenesq 03:52:17 PM
  442. I think people really do thin that inkscape is better funded
  443. johan_e
  444. johan_e 03:52:17 PM
  445. (random brainstorming here. tell me if not desired now)
  446. karenesq
  447. karenesq 03:52:24 PM
  448. great bryce!
  449. tedg
  450. tedg 03:52:29 PM
  451. Reality is that companies that make money by shipping Inkscape realize that it being better helps them :-)
  452. johan_e
  453. johan_e 03:52:29 PM
  454. bryce: ok, that is interesting to know
  455. ScislaC
  456. ScislaC 03:52:47 PM
  457. karenesq: they do, I think it ends up hurting us to some extent
  458. karenesq
  459. karenesq 03:52:49 PM
  460. yeah johan_e we'd put the logo on the event wiki and we could also put it in a write up of the event
  461. right tedg! 03:52:59 PM
  462. anyone who ships inkscape might want to sponsor 03:53:19 PM
  463. bryce
  464. bryce 03:53:22 PM
  465. unfortunately, inkscape is not on the list of projects they're targeting. But Cairo is, so like I said if we define it to include Cairo I can probably tap into that.
  466. karenesq
  467. karenesq 03:53:36 PM
  468. also, people who use inkscape in their business
  469. Mc-
  470. Mc- 03:53:38 PM
  471. i think companies like google can sponsor such events too
  472. karenesq
  473. karenesq 03:53:40 PM
  474. do we have a list like that?
  475. tedg
  476. tedg 03:53:48 PM
  477. They were recommending Inkscape for writing XAML at MS a while ago. Wonder if we can get them to sponsor.
  478. karenesq
  479. karenesq 03:54:08 PM
  480. yep, google does their budgeting a little earlier in the year (around July) but it never hurts to ask
  481. they have some flexibility 03:54:14 PM
  482. bryce
  483. bryce 03:55:05 PM
  484. should we think also beyond Linux? Any Apple/Windows type organizations that might want to contribute?
  485. karenesq
  486. karenesq 03:55:38 PM
  487. good point bryce
  488. doctormon
  489. doctormon 03:55:40 PM
  490. ScislaC: Maybe we should downgrade the website style sheet? :-P
  491. tedg
  492. tedg 03:56:12 PM
  493. bryce, I think that's a good idea, but I can't think of one.
  494. bryce
  495. bryce 03:56:19 PM
  496. ScislaC, honestly, looking at our income vs expenses, we actually are pretty well funded ;-)
  497. LiamW
  498. LiamW 03:56:26 PM
  499. Mac users... are not so happy with X11 inkscape
  500. johan_e
  501. johan_e 03:56:40 PM
  502. reasons for sponsors, I have now:
  503. * PR among users 03:56:40 PM
  504. * Improving a product that they ship 03:56:41 PM
  505. * Improving a product that many of their employees use 03:56:41 PM
  506. * PR among coders 03:56:41 PM
  507. ScislaC
  508. ScislaC 03:56:53 PM
  509. LiamW: correct, that hurts us a lot with that crowd
  510. bryce
  511. bryce 03:57:17 PM
  512. johan_e, sometimes they like the opportunities to "make contacts" either with the project's devs directly, or with their userbase
  513. doctormon
  514. doctormon 03:57:39 PM
  515. bryce: We're not well revenued ;-) but for windows/mac side of things, I think we need to actually start getting some money from those users somewhat. We have fewer distributors and more direct downloads. Maybe it'd be easier to focus on those bugs if we had some funding directly there?
  516. maybe off topic, let's leave that. 03:58:08 PM
  517. bryce
  518. bryce 03:58:25 PM
  519. LiamW, risking going off topic, but in fact that specific need was one of the items in Bradley's email. Namely the possibility of doing fundraising around hiring an experienced Mac packaging developer to get that fixed.
  520. karenesq
  521. karenesq 03:58:37 PM
  522. it may be a good idea to post on the Inkscape forum and ask if users would be interested in attending an event, and also ask if anyone's using it in a professional environment and willing to say
  523. johan_e
  524. johan_e 03:58:50 PM
  525. in terms of offering our sponsors something, I think we should be very wary of promising technical fixes/implementations/etc.
  526. LiamW
  527. LiamW 03:58:58 PM
  528. bryce: here we have a packager and a developer that are serious about osx packaging
  529. Tavmjong
  530. Tavmjong 03:58:58 PM
  531. How close is a non-X11 Mac Inkscape?
  532. tedg
  533. tedg 03:58:59 PM
  534. Wonder if we could get Xamarin to donate time to do Mac packaging… send a dev.
  535. bryce
  536. bryce 03:59:02 PM
  537. johan_e, agreed
  538. LiamW
  539. LiamW 03:59:06 PM
  540. Tavmjong, it's done already
  541. tedg
  542. tedg 03:59:16 PM
  543. They ship a GTK2 product on OSX.
  544. karenesq
  545. karenesq 03:59:16 PM
  546. right bryce, it's a good type of thing to fundraise for since those bugs are outside of the interest/expertise of the core team
  547. doctormon
  548. doctormon 03:59:30 PM
  549. bryce: certainly-offtopic: There's always a question of hiring inside or outside the tribe. An outside hire who never does any other devel might be a little poisonous to self devels.
  550. LiamW
  551. LiamW 03:59:31 PM
  552. but not that nice to work with yet (IMvHO) for power users
  553. Tavmjong
  554. Tavmjong 04:00:00 PM
  555. LiamW, so it just needs polishing?
  556. LiamW
  557. LiamW 04:00:13 PM
  558. the packaging is not really the issue IMO
  559. johan_e
  560. johan_e 04:00:13 PM
  561. Tavmjong, LiamW: i thought so too (polishing)
  562. LiamW
  563. LiamW 04:00:17 PM
  564. the code...
  565. the underlying code is already pretty broken on wayland 04:00:27 PM
  566. it's not so great with gtk+/quartz either 04:00:36 PM
  567. bryce
  568. bryce 04:00:39 PM
  569. doctormon, poisonous to the degree that you think it should be avoided entirely, or more like 'tread carefully'?
  570. doctormon
  571. doctormon 04:01:06 PM
  572. bryce: I think it's an unknown dose. Hopefully we won't die from the first experimental attempt.
  573. bryce
  574. bryce 04:01:39 PM
  575. doctormon, well I have on my todo list to get that fundraising plan posted on the website, then maybe we can try some small experiments via that.
  576. doctormon
  577. doctormon 04:01:47 PM
  578. good idea
  579. johan_e
  580. johan_e 04:01:57 PM
  581. bryce: "opportunities to "make contacts" either with the project's devs directly, or with their userbase" , can I group that under "PR" ?
  582. karenesq
  583. karenesq 04:02:06 PM
  584. a lot of projects (Conservancy member projects included) have done this with no ill effects AFAICT
  585. bryce
  586. bryce 04:02:25 PM
  587. johan_e, yep
  588. karenesq
  589. karenesq 04:02:40 PM
  590. well so before we move completely away from the sponsorship discussion, should we get some action items nailed down?
  591. I can ask Ruth if RH might have the budget and Cat at Google too 04:03:12 PM
  592. bryce
  593. bryce 04:03:15 PM
  594. karenesq, as we're at the hour mark, have we brainstormed adequate actions for you to work on?
  595. karenesq, heh 04:03:32 PM
  596. karenesq
  597. karenesq 04:03:42 PM
  598. bryce, I was just wondering if we should have weekly meetings for a few weeks
  599. I think there is a lot to talk about 04:03:50 PM
  600. bryce
  601. bryce 04:03:56 PM
  602. karenesq, I can do that
  603. karenesq
  604. karenesq 04:03:58 PM
  605. and we've barely scratched the surface
  606. bryce
  607. bryce 04:04:02 PM
  608. right
  609. tedg
  610. tedg 04:04:06 PM
  611. _1
  612. +1 04:04:08 PM
  613. Tavmjong
  614. Tavmjong 04:04:09 PM
  615. karenesq, Good idea!
  616. doctormon
  617. doctormon 04:04:20 PM
  618. very good idea :-)
  619. karenesq
  620. karenesq 04:04:24 PM
  621. also then we can track progress on action items ;D
  622. ScislaC
  623. ScislaC 04:04:29 PM
  624. I'm down
  625. bryce
  626. bryce 04:04:52 PM
  627. karenesq, I'm taking actions to get the fundraising doc posted on our website, and once we have things more nailed down to inquire with samsung for hackfest sponsorship
  628. karenesq
  629. karenesq 04:05:09 PM
  630. fantastic bryce
  631. LiamW
  632. LiamW 04:05:50 PM
  633. Tavmjong, johan_e: this manifestation of this particular issue, I thought, would have little to do with gtk+2/quartz
  634. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/96223438/irc/gtk%2B/flickering-gtk3-2.mp4 04:05:53 PM
  635. but it seems to have a lot to do with gtk2/quartz failing to redraw the canvas all the time 04:05:55 PM
  636. I asked around in #gtk+ on gimpnet 04:06:06 PM
  637. karenesq
  638. karenesq 04:06:13 PM
  639. so next week same time?
  640. LiamW
  641. LiamW 04:06:13 PM
  642. we're doing it all wrong, apparently
  643. johan_e
  644. johan_e 04:06:24 PM
  645. sec!
  646. Tavmjong
  647. Tavmjong 04:06:27 PM
  648. Sure!
  649. johan_e
  650. johan_e 04:06:30 PM
  651. (writing something on wiki)
  652. hold on a sec 04:06:35 PM
  653. a ok... you are not leaving 04:06:47 PM
  654. just discussing a next meeting 04:06:52 PM
  655. k 04:06:53 PM
  656. bryce
  657. bryce 04:06:59 PM
  658. ScislaC, I think you have the most recognition among the userbase right now - would you take the item to contact them for interest in the hackfest, and the action for getting a list of companies using inkscape?
  659. karenesq, yep 04:07:19 PM
  660. karenesq
  661. karenesq 04:07:34 PM
  662. yep johan_e, I'll idle here, but I'm going to go back to doing other things. feel free to ping me directly :)
  663. Tavmjong
  664. Tavmjong 04:07:39 PM
  665. Is someone going to summarize this meeting and post a note to the mailing list? I could do that but not till tomorrow.
  666. ScislaC
  667. ScislaC 04:07:46 PM
  668. bryce: I can own those two
  669. bryce
  670. bryce 04:08:06 PM
  671. Tavmjong, thanks that'd be great and tomorrow would be perfect
  672. johan_e
  673. johan_e 04:08:17 PM
  674. I've added a piece of text on sponsoring to the wiki page.
  675. bryce
  676. bryce 04:08:27 PM
  677. johan_e, mind adding these action items to the wiki too?
  678. jabiertxof
  679. jabiertxof 04:08:55 PM
  680. in inkscapeforums.com?
  681. johan_e
  682. johan_e 04:08:58 PM
  683. I really think it is not good to approach sponsors without giving them an idea of what they can expect from us. If instead we have a well thought-out plan already, they have to find an excuse for not sponsoring
  684. jabiertxof
  685. jabiertxof 04:09:06 PM
  686. has a lot of users
  687. johan_e
  688. johan_e 04:09:15 PM
  689. bryce: i lost track of them, can you list?
  690. jabiertxof
  691. jabiertxof 04:09:27 PM
  692. http://www.inkscapeforum.com/
  693. bryce
  694. bryce 04:09:28 PM
  695. johan_e, I completely agree. We need to have some specifics nailed down
  696. jabiertxof, I think just inkscape-user@ should be sufficient but defer to josh's judgment 04:09:52 PM
  697. johan_e, sure one sec 04:10:53 PM
  698. karenesq
  699. karenesq 04:11:09 PM
  700. johan_e, for many sponsors knowing that it's a hackfest for something they're interested in is enough.
  701. and it's better to get them before they finalize their budget for the year 04:11:23 PM
  702. anyway really going back to other things :D 04:11:36 PM
  703. Tavmjong
  704. Tavmjong 04:11:53 PM
  705. Who here plans on being at LGM? At the hackfest?
  706. johan_e
  707. johan_e 04:11:56 PM
  708. karenesq: ok, thanks
  709. ScislaC
  710. ScislaC 04:11:57 PM
  711. jabiertxof: I will consider it. (that's not a concrete yes or no at this time)
  712. Mc-
  713. Mc- 04:12:05 PM
  714. i'd say that too... and having it public at MIT that they sponsor some event for a libre software is already a good PR for potential people they'll be interested in
  715. ScislaC
  716. ScislaC 04:12:15 PM
  717. I plan to attend both
  718. Mc-
  719. Mc- 04:12:21 PM
  720. (if that's at mit)
  721. Tavmjong
  722. Tavmjong 04:12:52 PM
  723. I plan on being at both.
  724. doctormon
  725. doctormon 04:12:56 PM
  726. Tavmjong: I'll fight hard to be at LGM and the hackfest.
  727. johan_e
  728. johan_e 04:13:09 PM
  729. Tavmjong: I plan to attend both, if (almost) fully funded.
  730. ScislaC
  731. ScislaC 04:14:16 PM
  732. Tavmjong: add johan's caveat to what I said ;)
  733. johan_e
  734. johan_e 04:14:27 PM
  735. remote attendance is also possible I'd think? (say, reviewing code fragments or smth)
  736. doctormon
  737. doctormon 04:18:01 PM
  738. While people are here: The website actions to come include: An alert system for translators about new content. If anyone has any priorities, let me know now.
  739. jabiertxof
  740. jabiertxof 04:18:02 PM
  741. ok ScislaC
  742. bryce
  743. bryce 04:18:21 PM
  744. johan_e, ok I think I got most of what we discussed - http://pastebin.com/DHWZ1SpM
  745. Tavmjong, count me 04:18:34 PM
  746. Tavmjong
  747. Tavmjong 04:19:05 PM
  748. So we have at least five!
  749. It's past my bedtime... so see you all next week. 04:19:24 PM
  750. bryce
  751. bryce 04:19:34 PM
  752. lunch time for me. thanks all, cya!
  753. johan_e
  754. johan_e 04:19:37 PM
  755. ltr Tavmjong
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IRC Meeting for Hackfest 2014-09-15

od Martin Owens

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