How do you combine all the traces to one, leaving a path around the outside and inside to manipulate. so I have a bitmap edging, that is in brown and blue and not solid color. so i got 8 paths.
Can i combine them all into just the one object, removing all the inner nodes for the colors? Then manipulate the outer and inner nodes together er, horizontally. You know grab the out and inside two nodes and pull them out further? Yeah.. I have a rectangle that i want to change one end to a scallop.
Putting something to represent your border - eg 0.1 mm circle if circular frame intended - around it before export will help with resizing when you pull it back in. Inkscape has a tendency to change sizes and the X-Y proportions do not always stay the same.
Export your trace as a PNG.
Reimport
Place your new Bitmap under your frame.
If you want it to be a circle, you will need to erase the fall out parts in GIMP etc as Inkscape exports are always right angle cornered.
I just selected them all and used path union, giving me the combined scan paths with an outside path and inside path, all inner points removed.
Nelchai? i dont want a bitmap of it, i want the nodes to manipulate the edges from a straight line to a scalloped line. then I would export it as a png.
@anybody3 I think I know exactly what you are trying to do. I spent last night doing the same thing to recreate honeybees for the game Agon, previously did it for a dart board, tonight I will probably do it for a series of goose illustrations for a recreation of an old game called Goose, etc.
You ask - [ Reading your post, I think it may have been edited? If I remember correctly, you were asking about the traces that resulted from a trace bitmap?]
How do you combine all the traces to one, leaving a path around the outside and inside to manipulate.
My answer - may be different in 1+, but in 93 - In a complex trace, there are so many nodes in the 8 layers of node clouds in the item you just created, that operations like exclusion, union, etc will produce a more unsatisfactory result than just tracing the lines you want. To see what I mean, take your trace set, make a new copy of it, move it into the clear, break apart the trace, separate the 8 layers so that you see each individually. Take each one and break that layer apart and ungroup it. Do you see how all of the holes in the original little traces changed color and filled in? If you try to separate all of those small node sets out from the others, it will take hours to get it done. The computer has to do that with all of them for all 8 layers when you tell it to union, or intersect etc. You will have a more reliable and artistically controlled final if you manually trace your image. This will give you an inner trace to manipulate. Creating a border around the whole thing will give you the outer. Group together.... Union etc may work for small images, but, more complex bitmaps will turn out "messy."
so I have a bitmap edging, that is in brown and blue and not solid color. so i got 8 paths.
My answer - I am visualizing a gold picture frame around a traditional painting. I know that is not what you have, but it is a close variant that I have experience with recreating. I think you may want the 8 color layers to vary their colors to experiment with different looks to create different light effects upon your frame. By light effects I do not mean "neon" or "cartoon." I mean that you may want the upper left corner to be brighter than the lower right because that is what Rembrandt lighting does to an image. [ or a frame on a wall in cool light interior, etc ]
Achieving that effect is done by pulling each layer out and changing the colors, opacities, overlapping line work and other artistries to accomplish it, The issue you are going to face is Method of Work. This is where knowledge of art history comes in. Traditionally, image production was achieved with processes like wood block printing. To keep all of the several layers of color aligned in an image, the artists used a series of registry marks. If you look at the edge of a modern piece of bolt fabric, you will see a series of numbered, colored circles. These are registry marks. You will need to create a series for your image as well.
Test this. Use your earlier copy of your image. Once the layers have been ungrouped - without a deep ungrouping that separates out all of the sub node clouds - look at the bounding boxes for your 8 layers. They are all different! The layers are bound by their extremities. They are not bound by the overall image they originally composed. This means that when you try to realign the layers post modification, they will not align. You will have to go through each layer and do it manually, and that takes a heck of a lot of time in a complex trace. This is not a bug. There is really no way to write code to do this automatically. If there were, bolt fabric would not have registry marks either.
The better Method of Work will be to create a single mark - I use a large white dot at the lower left corner outside the overall bounding box - to group to each layer and move it. If you have 8 layers, create 8 copies of the dot and stack them atop one another. Select a layer - select a dot - ctrl G - move layer. Repeat 8 times. At this point you will see that one layer is a large item. Another layer will look like a few bits and pieces. Decide for your image which layer is the top, bottom, and tween sequence. Put another registry dot tailored for each layer next to the original dot. Have the under layer dot closest to the main registry. The uppermost dot is farthest away. The tweens... Anyway, these dots will give you the ability to select specific parts of your trace stack for modification. The placing will tell you that far left is all the way down. 5th from the left is 3 layers down from top. When you select that layer to enhance, pull it up to the top, change it, drop it down three times. When you have your composition the way you want it, align all of the original registry marks, remove the working marks, and regroup the construct to have your final image.
Can i combine them all into just the one object, removing all the inner nodes for the colors?
My answer - see first answer this post.
Then manipulate the outer and inner nodes together er, horizontally. You know grab the out and inside two nodes and pull them out further?
My answer - you could do this two ways. First, pull the arrows and stretch your image. Ctrl will limit the change.
The second way is to select the image - activate the node tool - select a line or zone of nodes by dragging a bounding box over them - grab one node - pull it where you want your group - again, CTRL will limit the move.
Yeah.. I have a rectangle that i want to change one end to a scallop.
My answer - create your frame. Create your scallop. Overlap and position them the way you want them. Select your image. Activate the node tool. You will see a group of nodes extending past your edges. Find a line segment that enters your frame space. Place a node on that segment within the frame space. Do this at the other end of that piece of spaghetti. You will have to do this every time the spaghetti reenters your frame. Then, select the piece of spaghetti that extends into your frame space - path > break apart. You may need to ungroup your construct as well. Delete the bad segments. Use the node tool to reconnect the end points you just created. Manually pull the curves into the frame space to hide them. Make sure you did not loose anything important in your image. Repair as necessary.
[ I think 1+ has automated this cutting process. ? ]
Nelchai, Thank you. I understand all of that. No i did not edit my question. Well that i can remember anyway ;) Computer can track without registration marks, as in 'undo' . However going from one medium to another, the registration marks are needed to start the code in the correct spot. You see? Transferring an image from the computer to the fabric printer, whatever its called, it needs a place to start. A way for people to make sure it is starting in the correct alignment. Even today many still print by hand, and need the registration makes. I used to hand screen print fabrics long long ago. It was great fun. OK all that being said.
I have a rectangle frame, not like a picture frame, just a frame of colors. The inside 97% is empty, no color. The colors in that frame are one of a kind, never to be made again except by duplication, and thats the challenge. I want to take one end of the frame, and just pull out some scallops in it to match the scallops of another vector or image. so that the new image has that same look, the 'frame' is now a rectangle but one end, has 5 scallops on it. I dont want to change the colors, nothing fancy, i just want to pull those nodes from that one end to the shape of the 5 scallops.
I did do the union, but the end result looked to cartoonish to use that way. It would take many more scans than 8 i think to get it to look better. I thought inkscape could trace the inside and outside edges, and then i could just pull the nodes to create the scallops, but thats not how it works. I just gave up trying to get that to work. I just used the frame, deleted the one edge and then trying to paint the scallops to match the frame. Its taking forever and is just frustrating.
Tyler .. . I can post the file, but its not that important. I mean the file. lol. i dont even know how to add it here, ill look around to see how. Tried to post a png and cant do that either here.
So is there a way to just put in the nodes i want to use on the bitmap, and manipulate it that way? You know a node in each outside corner, and inside corner, and then extra nodes on one end outside and inside, where i can pull them out for the scallops? Thats what i wanted to do, but looking at tutorials online it seemed the only way was to use the trace bitmap. Ok thanks again. Still cant figure out how to load the file here or a png
If it is a bitmap - it only has 4 nodes - 1 each corner. It would need to be traced. With that we are back to square 1.
As far as the registry marks are concerned, they are the only way to accomplish the task I outlined in a complex image. The computer can not track these new items in association to one another without registry marks. As I said, the process creates bounding boxes that are no longer the proper size in relation to their previous arrangement.
How do you combine all the traces to one, leaving a path around the outside and inside to manipulate. so I have a bitmap edging, that is in brown and blue and not solid color. so i got 8 paths.
Can i combine them all into just the one object, removing all the inner nodes for the colors? Then manipulate the outer and inner nodes together er, horizontally. You know grab the out and inside two nodes and pull them out further? Yeah.. I have a rectangle that i want to change one end to a scallop.
Thank you =)
Why did trace 8 colors when you just need 2?
Um, really? because i need all the colors, not just two. lol.
Do your trace at 8 colors.
Putting something to represent your border - eg 0.1 mm circle if circular frame intended - around it before export will help with resizing when you pull it back in. Inkscape has a tendency to change sizes and the X-Y proportions do not always stay the same.
Export your trace as a PNG.
Reimport
Place your new Bitmap under your frame.
If you want it to be a circle, you will need to erase the fall out parts in GIMP etc as Inkscape exports are always right angle cornered.
There may be another way in 1+, but, I use 93.
@anybody3, please share an example file so we can get a better idea of what you would like to achieve.
I just selected them all and used path union, giving me the combined scan paths with an outside path and inside path, all inner points removed.
Nelchai? i dont want a bitmap of it, i want the nodes to manipulate the edges from a straight line to a scalloped line. then I would export it as a png.
Any screenshot or example file available?
@anybody3 I think I know exactly what you are trying to do. I spent last night doing the same thing to recreate honeybees for the game Agon, previously did it for a dart board, tonight I will probably do it for a series of goose illustrations for a recreation of an old game called Goose, etc.
You ask - [ Reading your post, I think it may have been edited? If I remember correctly, you were asking about the traces that resulted from a trace bitmap?]
How do you combine all the traces to one, leaving a path around the outside and inside to manipulate.
My answer - may be different in 1+, but in 93 - In a complex trace, there are so many nodes in the 8 layers of node clouds in the item you just created, that operations like exclusion, union, etc will produce a more unsatisfactory result than just tracing the lines you want. To see what I mean, take your trace set, make a new copy of it, move it into the clear, break apart the trace, separate the 8 layers so that you see each individually. Take each one and break that layer apart and ungroup it. Do you see how all of the holes in the original little traces changed color and filled in? If you try to separate all of those small node sets out from the others, it will take hours to get it done. The computer has to do that with all of them for all 8 layers when you tell it to union, or intersect etc. You will have a more reliable and artistically controlled final if you manually trace your image. This will give you an inner trace to manipulate. Creating a border around the whole thing will give you the outer. Group together.... Union etc may work for small images, but, more complex bitmaps will turn out "messy."
so I have a bitmap edging, that is in brown and blue and not solid color. so i got 8 paths.
My answer - I am visualizing a gold picture frame around a traditional painting. I know that is not what you have, but it is a close variant that I have experience with recreating. I think you may want the 8 color layers to vary their colors to experiment with different looks to create different light effects upon your frame. By light effects I do not mean "neon" or "cartoon." I mean that you may want the upper left corner to be brighter than the lower right because that is what Rembrandt lighting does to an image. [ or a frame on a wall in cool light interior, etc ]
Achieving that effect is done by pulling each layer out and changing the colors, opacities, overlapping line work and other artistries to accomplish it, The issue you are going to face is Method of Work. This is where knowledge of art history comes in. Traditionally, image production was achieved with processes like wood block printing. To keep all of the several layers of color aligned in an image, the artists used a series of registry marks. If you look at the edge of a modern piece of bolt fabric, you will see a series of numbered, colored circles. These are registry marks. You will need to create a series for your image as well.
Test this. Use your earlier copy of your image. Once the layers have been ungrouped - without a deep ungrouping that separates out all of the sub node clouds - look at the bounding boxes for your 8 layers. They are all different! The layers are bound by their extremities. They are not bound by the overall image they originally composed. This means that when you try to realign the layers post modification, they will not align. You will have to go through each layer and do it manually, and that takes a heck of a lot of time in a complex trace. This is not a bug. There is really no way to write code to do this automatically. If there were, bolt fabric would not have registry marks either.
The better Method of Work will be to create a single mark - I use a large white dot at the lower left corner outside the overall bounding box - to group to each layer and move it. If you have 8 layers, create 8 copies of the dot and stack them atop one another. Select a layer - select a dot - ctrl G - move layer. Repeat 8 times. At this point you will see that one layer is a large item. Another layer will look like a few bits and pieces. Decide for your image which layer is the top, bottom, and tween sequence. Put another registry dot tailored for each layer next to the original dot. Have the under layer dot closest to the main registry. The uppermost dot is farthest away. The tweens... Anyway, these dots will give you the ability to select specific parts of your trace stack for modification. The placing will tell you that far left is all the way down. 5th from the left is 3 layers down from top. When you select that layer to enhance, pull it up to the top, change it, drop it down three times. When you have your composition the way you want it, align all of the original registry marks, remove the working marks, and regroup the construct to have your final image.
Can i combine them all into just the one object, removing all the inner nodes for the colors?
My answer - see first answer this post.
Then manipulate the outer and inner nodes together er, horizontally. You know grab the out and inside two nodes and pull them out further?
My answer - you could do this two ways. First, pull the arrows and stretch your image. Ctrl will limit the change.
The second way is to select the image - activate the node tool - select a line or zone of nodes by dragging a bounding box over them - grab one node - pull it where you want your group - again, CTRL will limit the move.
Yeah.. I have a rectangle that i want to change one end to a scallop.
My answer - create your frame. Create your scallop. Overlap and position them the way you want them. Select your image. Activate the node tool. You will see a group of nodes extending past your edges. Find a line segment that enters your frame space. Place a node on that segment within the frame space. Do this at the other end of that piece of spaghetti. You will have to do this every time the spaghetti reenters your frame. Then, select the piece of spaghetti that extends into your frame space - path > break apart. You may need to ungroup your construct as well. Delete the bad segments. Use the node tool to reconnect the end points you just created. Manually pull the curves into the frame space to hide them. Make sure you did not loose anything important in your image. Repair as necessary.
[ I think 1+ has automated this cutting process. ? ]
Without an example SVG file, all is simple speculation.
Nelchai, Thank you. I understand all of that. No i did not edit my question. Well that i can remember anyway ;) Computer can track without registration marks, as in 'undo' . However going from one medium to another, the registration marks are needed to start the code in the correct spot. You see? Transferring an image from the computer to the fabric printer, whatever its called, it needs a place to start. A way for people to make sure it is starting in the correct alignment. Even today many still print by hand, and need the registration makes. I used to hand screen print fabrics long long ago. It was great fun. OK all that being said.
I have a rectangle frame, not like a picture frame, just a frame of colors. The inside 97% is empty, no color. The colors in that frame are one of a kind, never to be made again except by duplication, and thats the challenge. I want to take one end of the frame, and just pull out some scallops in it to match the scallops of another vector or image. so that the new image has that same look, the 'frame' is now a rectangle but one end, has 5 scallops on it. I dont want to change the colors, nothing fancy, i just want to pull those nodes from that one end to the shape of the 5 scallops.
I did do the union, but the end result looked to cartoonish to use that way. It would take many more scans than 8 i think to get it to look better. I thought inkscape could trace the inside and outside edges, and then i could just pull the nodes to create the scallops, but thats not how it works. I just gave up trying to get that to work. I just used the frame, deleted the one edge and then trying to paint the scallops to match the frame. Its taking forever and is just frustrating.
Tyler .. . I can post the file, but its not that important. I mean the file. lol. i dont even know how to add it here, ill look around to see how. Tried to post a png and cant do that either here.
So is there a way to just put in the nodes i want to use on the bitmap, and manipulate it that way? You know a node in each outside corner, and inside corner, and then extra nodes on one end outside and inside, where i can pull them out for the scallops? Thats what i wanted to do, but looking at tutorials online it seemed the only way was to use the trace bitmap. Ok thanks again. Still cant figure out how to load the file here or a png
Select your asset - pull the arrows.
If it is a bitmap - it only has 4 nodes - 1 each corner. It would need to be traced. With that we are back to square 1.
As far as the registry marks are concerned, they are the only way to accomplish the task I outlined in a complex image. The computer can not track these new items in association to one another without registry marks. As I said, the process creates bounding boxes that are no longer the proper size in relation to their previous arrangement.
@anybody3, To attach a file, click the paperclip button to the lower-left of the reply area.
i know what you are asking.
Time.
While I am trying to practice my writing and communication skills with every opportunity that I get - I am also trying to not overload your posts.
:-(